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Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:00:00

Do you ever glance around and realize that you aren't as young as you once were? I am the queen of denial on this. It's actually helpful when I have other people get older. And then I realize, oh, wait, that means I'm older too. Someone else's child graduating to the next level in school. Wait, they're going to elementary school next year. Your child is in college. Helps me realize that I'm getting older. There's a great story once where my brother did something and I said, wait, you're this old.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:00:36

How can you be doing that? And he told me he was actually older than that, and I was older than that too, was the end result of that realization. We're getting older, which means our parents are getting older, too. I've had some interesting conversations in the last few months about parents aging, and since I lost my mom some time ago, I forget that there's lessons I've learned that others haven't had time to process or experience. So today I'm going to share with you three insights on changing relationships as parents age or their medical condition changes that you might find useful. Don't worry. We're also going to start with some amusing stories because you know me, it's a bit of a meandering. I think you'll get a lot out of it, and I'm glad you're here today. Welcome to the Grit show, where our focus is growth on purpose.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:01:34

I'm your host, Shawna Rodrigues, and I'm honored to be part of this community as we journey together with our grit intact to learn more about how to thrive and how to get the most out of life. It means a lot that you are here today. As you listen, I encourage you to think of who may appreciate the tidbits of knowledge we are sharing and to take a moment to pass this along to them. Everyone appreciates the friend that thinks of them, and these conversations are meant to be shared. And to spark even more connections. If you follow me on Facebook or Instagram, you recently saw that where I live, we went from 78 degrees to snow a day later. Seasons are a changing, right? It does have me thinking about the different seasons. I'm also getting ready to see some dear friends at my upcoming nuptials in the coming weeks, and it reminded me of a camping trip I took with some friends many years ago in New England.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:02:40

I think we were actually camping in New Hampshire, that we went hiking in Maine and picked the most amazing blueberries. And on that trip, possibly the funniest thing that happened was one of my friends was talking about how they couldn't believe it was so dark already, and we were all looking around at how bright it was, and then looked at the friend and realized that they were still wearing their prescription sunglasses. And that's why they thought it was so dark. And we all started laughing. Cause they had to say it a couple of times before we're all like, not really that dark. Why does she keep saying that? She was still wearing her sunglasses. So we all laughed. But what was possibly the funniest was the campsite nearby.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:03:24

And they were drinking up late, having fun, and we were up late as well. But we'd gone to bed, and we're in three separate tents because there's three groups of us that were there camping together. And for some reason, one of the women at the other campsite was loudly talking about something she told her son. And it was. It's the circle of life. It's just the circle of life. We were guessing it had to do with an animal dying or something they'd seen, but somebody from their tent had to repeat what she said. And then we all couldn't stop giggling and stayed up very late.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:04:00

Since then, we get to reflect on the fact that it's the circle of life. It's the circle of life. Good example of a location joke, right? So, with the circle of life, I definitely recognized that I specialized in work with young children for a large portion of my career. I did not specialize with working with aging adults. I had other dear friends who did specialize in that work. And it impressed upon me that there were some similarities in some ways. And I found that heartening in some ways, that we kind of return in a circle, that there's some things about us that kind of go back to that. And I've enjoyed those observations over time and cherished the innocence and the lack of inhibitions that older adults have, which sometimes can be frustrating.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:04:53

That is just part of the ways that we travel through life, that we get closer to that, and we don't have it to start with, and we lose some of it at the end, and it kind of goes in that circle. And when someone very dear to me is in hospice and has been for a while now, for a few months now, and I'm very lucky we still have them. And I actually get to go visit her at the end of this week. I'm so excited. I've had this many visits with her. I didn't expect to still have her this long, considering things. And as I talk through this, you guys know that I'm very open about me on my podcast, but there's always this interesting line that I'm not as open about other people because I want to respect their privacy, even though I choose to be very open. So forgive me as I walk that line a little bit in this conversation with y'all today.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:05:43

So something very dear to me is on hospice, and I was speaking with one of their daughters a while back, and it was very interesting to me that I didn't realize how much I had to offer the conversation. I forget that losing my mother 15 years ago means that what I've experienced, that I went through with her because she had both breast cancer. That was quite a journey. Medical journey with her, as well as her having a metastatic melanoma was quite a journey with her. And going through those journeys with her means that I've experienced a lot of things through that some time ago that a lot of people haven't necessarily experienced for their parents, and that people that are the age my mom would be maybe haven't experienced those things, even though I experienced those at a much earlier point in my life, then people have experienced those things. So we had very quality conversations around some of those different pieces, and I didn't tend at that time, but it's been a. It's been a period because it was the anniversary of losing my mom recently, and a lot of other things have been going on that I had in my mind that I would love to actually talk with you more about this and thinking that this was more of a conversation to have. And I have other friends whose parents have been having medical shifts and changes and going through things and wondered about how valuable some of that conversation might be to have, because we are of age as that's happening.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:07:07

And obviously, I had these experiences with my mom 15 years ago. So it's not like there's a certain age you hit when you start experiencing this, right? You could be any age and be experiencing transitions with either aging parents or more medically fragile parents that are experiencing some of these things. And it might be a worthwhile conversation to have about those shifting roles and the way things are different, that experience. So today, I thought you guys might enjoy having a bit of that conversation to think more about that. One of the biggest things that took me a little while to reconcile when my mother was sick, she was the sweetest woman if you knew my mother, and if you've ever been on Facebook when I comment on her or drop a memory of her, there's so many people that talk about missing her and how wonderful and sweet she was. She worked in special education, and she'd worked in the school cafeteria, and everyone loved her. Everyone called her mom. She was just a dear, sweet, sweet woman.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:08:09

She was very kind to people and very much loved when she was going through her medical journey, which was quite a journey. She went through a lot when she was going through her medical journey. It's very hard to be losing control of your body, to not have control over your health, and to be having to navigate medical procedures and doctor's appointments and figuring those things out. And she was still a very sweet, very dear, wonderful woman. Like that did not change, like losing control of so many things. There's other things that you try to control and what those nearest and dearest experience is different than what people that are dropping in and bringing things and offering thoughts and love and delivering stuff. And so it's funny that I don't talk extremely publicly, I guess, about that and don't think about that, because, again, my mother's well loved and she's a beautiful, wonderful human being, and that doesn't change that. But it's a very common thing that when you are losing control of things, of your life, and it doesn't have to just be medically, right.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:09:16

But medically is the biggest example, especially when you are terminally ill and you don't have control over that, right? That's not something you can just wave a wand and change. And you're working very hard to address your health and doing those pieces that there's so many things that you try to control and you don't even realize you're doing it. Don't even realize. And so I definitely knew that. But it took some getting used to, and it would be so interesting with my experience with my mom. And it was valuable for this to have been shared with this other woman who's experiencing stuff with her family as well, that my mom love her to death. But I was doing laundry, and the way I folded everything was a problem because I didn't fold things the same way she did, because she would gladly be folding the laundry. She didn't want me folding her laundry.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:10:02

That's the last thing she wanted, was me folding her laundry. She wanted to be well, doing her job, taking care of her own house, and not needing me to be there to take care of her because she was sick. She did not want me doing her laundry for those reasons. And if she was doing her laundry, she could fold exactly the way she wanted it to. And as somebody who folds my own laundry? There is a way. I fold my laundry so it fits in my drawers, and so things happen. And I once lived in the same house as her. She taught me how to fold laundry, so I probably should have known exactly how she liked it.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:10:30

But I'd since moved on. And I remember my college boyfriend's mother is who actually taught me how to fold t shirts in a way that I thought was brilliant. And that's how I fold t shirts. Right? So my mother had worked at David's department store. I remember which department store. She worked at David's department store as one of her first jobs or the first job she loved. And they actually have one of those t shirt folding things that you fold t shirts on, so everything was folded in thirds, which is really hard to do without that t shirt folding device. And I hated folding t shirts like that because I could never get them to sew.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:11:04

And in college, when my college boyfriend's mom had a different way of folding t shirts, I thought that was brilliant. And that's how I started folding t shirts ever since then. So I didn't fold t shirts the same way I fold towels differently. Cause I think it's easier. Like, I have my own way of folding things. And my mother, it would make her crazy the way I would fold t shirts. It would make her crazy the way that I put dishes away. And it was one of those things that she was just trying to control things because her health was not in her control.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:11:32

And she's the dearest, sweetest, most lovely woman, but that's the way that she was. And so it's useful to know that if you knew my mother and you knew what a beautiful, sweet woman she was, that even the most beautiful, sweet woman is going to be trying to control the things when they're trying to be helped. She loved me. I know she loved me. And fortunately, was very strong. I can't imagine if I had an acrimonious relationship with my mother and she was getting frustrated with how I was doing things to help her, that that would not have been good, because I might have taken it personally that she wasn't grateful for me helping her, et cetera. Because it wasn't about that. It was about everything was out of control.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:12:13

And she's trying to control how I'm cooking something, how I'm folding something, how I'm doing something, because she didn't want me there helping her. And when her best friend, who amazing like that is just such a beautiful story, her best friend came up from California and came and lived with her for a time during her breast cancer treatment. Isn't that beautiful? That's so beautiful. I love that. My aunt is amazing. We called her my aunt growing up. So she actually came and lived with my mom to help out and do things that I'm sure when I was there, she was always very grateful and wasn't the same with her because it was a different relationship. Right.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:12:48

But I was her daughter, and it was different. And so it's helpful for you to hear this when hopefully your parent is not ill, hopefully they aren't aging, and at that place, hopefully they aren't grappling with that and needing to be controlling so that when they do that, you can simply be like, oh, this isn't about me. They're being controlling. They feel the need to control because their health is not in their control. All these other things are not in their control. And that's why they're needing to control how loud I am, putting the silverware in the drawer, the way that I'm folding the towels, where I'm putting things in the cupboards, and double checking how long I'm cooking this for or how this is being done, because they feel like there's so many things they can't control, and I'm a safe person to control things with. Which kind of brings us to the second point of the older you get, or possibly the closer you get to death, because my mother wasn't as old as some folks, that the more childlike you become, right. And the more particular you are about how things are done and the less inhibitions you have and the more raw your emotions are and the harder time you have controlling those emotions, and the more you can see those experiences as being like that, as being more sensitive to noise, needing more rest, being more irritable when you're tired, needing to have food, as a way to regulate emotions, the more that you can give them the caring consideration that you would give a three year old, instead of like, this is my parent, or this is this adult, like, why are they acting like a child? Instead of going, you know, this is a circle we're arching back to this point, and we just need to give them this grace and see them more childlike and honestly, in a very respectful, very giving grace, using this as a way to understand and love on them, to give them that same grace and love that you would a child, and to be able to recognize that when they're seeming irritable, that it is a good idea to offer them a snack and that maybe even though they want to do a longer walk and spend more time outside, that maybe it's okay to suggest that we should head back.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:15:15

And just like with a kid that might have a really hard time, that we're heading back early. That part of the reason, it's because they need to head back at saying because we need to head back. Right. That is having the same grace you have with a kid, that you take some of that responsibility back. That it is this arch and there is this grief piece, right? There is room, if you need to say, like, wow, I need to give space for my relationship with my parent, my relationship with this person to shift because their health is shifting, their age is shifting, who they are is shifting, that you need to give room and grace for that relationship to change and you are allowed to grieve that. And I love that. We just had an episode last week. Do you check it out? Number 91, when we learned about aft and tapping and this process of talking out loud about things that you're experiencing.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:16:16

And maybe that's something you need to talk out loud to yourself about, to a friend, about to a therapist about to like, work through that shift and that change and to be able to grieve that relationship has changed and it's different because it's reached a different point because of where they're at. And that can be hard to accept because it was really nice when they got to be your friend and they got to be a fellow adult and you moved past all these other things. And as you can accept that it's at a different phase and they're in a different place, then you can stop feeling like you need to manage and take care of them and have this grace of where they're at and what their needs are. Because there's actually, there is research about the frustration of older adults feeling like they're being managed by their adult children and feeling like decisions are being made for them and they're being like treating them like a child. So, like, there's this balance of respecting that their, their needs are changing and how we handle their needs, that we're giving them room for that. But that doesn't mean that they can't still be respected and they can't still make decisions. They don't still have the brain of an adult, but they have some needs and shifts. And just because there's one shift in the fact that they may need more rest, the fact they may need to eat more frequently, that they have, like, physiological needs that are shifting, that are becoming more childlike, that they need more rest, and they have less inhibitions, and they have a lower tolerance for stress.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:17:46

And those different pieces doesn't mean that they can't cognitively make decisions that's like an individual basis. Right? Like, where their cognitive decline may or may not be. Right. So they're still able to make decisions. They're still able to be an adult in many ways, but there's some physical aspects of how those things are changing, and so it can be hard to differentiate those pieces of what they actually need physically and what they need emotionally and how you can kind of balance those pieces, right? Yeah, it's tricky. It's tricky, huh? Because you're mourning the relationship, and then the tendency is, like, when you're mourning the relationship, just, like, flip a switch and just treat everything differently and just put it over in this other category instead of doing that dance of, like, what pieces are different, what pieces are still the same? And mourning the pieces you've lost that you like the best. Right. And then shifting over into this.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:18:41

Well, now I have to do everything and how to take care of everything, et cetera, et cetera. And to be able to help them come to terms with the fact that they don't like that they're tired more easily now. They don't like that they have a lower stress tolerance. They may not realize that they have lower inhibitions. And they're more quick to tell you that eyeshadow looks horrible on you, or you really tell your daughter that she should never wear that shirt in public or the things they wouldn't have said, you know, five years earlier, that they will do that. And it's also hard, too, because this goes into the third point that just like with, if you're a parent or if you've been around parents and young children, you recognize that when you're a great parent and you're a safe space, chances are that your kid will have the meltdown as soon as they walk on the front door. Even though they kept it together all day at school and with my mom, I was a safe space. So that's why she could let me know what she thought about the way I prepared the meatloaf or the how long I boiled the egg for or the way I folded the towels.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:19:50

She wouldn't do that with her dear friend, who moved up to help out and take care of her and be there for her, but she would do that with me because it's just different with family, right? Like, I can go over to my friend's house and take care of her kids who had a terrible day, and they'll still be great for me. But if mom was home, they would be having meltdowns all over the couch and would refuse to go to bed and take baths. And just because it was safe to fully express your emotions and to have that space and have that meltdown, which probably what they need, right? They actually need to work through those things and experience that and do that even better. If they can get somebody, they can talk through those things and maybe have some realizations and aha. Moments about and talk through how hard it is to have that loss of control. And that is the thing that you can do, and it can be your resource. It's like when I worked with adults who had our parents who had young children, and the worst thing that a mother could have happen is have her child say that they hated them and the child was using that as a tool, but that's not necessarily what the child was saying. So we had to look at what the child might be saying and respond to what the child might be saying underneath that and just not respond to that word, let it be a trigger.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:21:03

Right? And so when the adult is saying, when your parent is saying to you, like, I can't believe that you're not seeing me more, you're not spending more time with me, that you're not here more, for me to reflect on what that might be about and to say, it must be really hard to be alone so much. It must be really hard to not have your partner with you anymore. It's been really hard since that person's been gone. That was the person that was after you all the time. And it's hard that I'm not here more often. And I can imagine that's really hard for you to not be having me here more often. Instead of you feeling like I'm not gonna hear more, I should be here more. They're upset because I'm not here more.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:21:44

Instead of realizing, like, it's not realistic for you to be there more, you're there as much as you can be, you're doing as much as you can. And to be firm in who you are and what you're providing, and then to be able to reflect on what they're saying, what they need to hear and what they're feeling is that they're alone and they're missing the people that they used to have or where they used to live, or someone who's passed that used to be their person, that they expected to have with them to the very end. That's not going to be there at the very end. Or maybe they're just scared to pass when nobody's there. So to try to hear what's underneath what they're saying, right. That's kind of part of what you can do to help make it a little bit easier as being that one person for them. But had I had myself reflecting to me, to be able to say, it must be really hard to not be able to know what's happening next with your health and to feel like your body is betraying you and to not feel like you can control how you're going to feel from day to day, and to not know what's going to happen next with things medically, that must be really stressful. It must be really hard to not feel like you can control things with your health right now.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:22:58

And perhaps if I could have reflected that more, there could have been an easier time letting up. I will never know because I never tried that technique. But based on the other things I've learned with kids and other work that I did back in my career, it seems that might have been helpful for me. It was just enough for me to be able to reflect myself, that's why it was happening and it wasn't about me. And I didn't take it personally and try to figure out how I supposed to fold the towels. But it didn't matter because then it would be the way that I put things back on a shelf or the way that I did something with boiling the water and to recognize it. So there wasn't always a solution for it because it wasn't about how long the water had boiled or not. It was good for me just to know that.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:23:39

So it might be enough for you just to know that it's not about you that is that about what you're doing and you're not alone. You aren't the only caregiver or loved one. And that them being super loving or caring to a friend that walks in the door, perhaps even another sibling or another person in the family, that it's not because they love that person more. Like it's just because you're the safe person and that's what it's about. So really, it's a compliment in many ways that they can let their guard down and express those emotions, even though that's not, you know, the ideal way. Unfortunately, it's a human way. And so it'd be great if we could all get supports around that and how to work through those emotions. So we're not expressing that different way, but for you to hear and to know that you aren't alone and it's not you.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:24:30

And it is hard. It is hard to have those relationships change. And for the person you once relied on to be reliant on you and for sometimes for that to take a long time, that you are that caregiver and that that relationship is going that way and that you should seek out support. And there are caregiver support groups if it is more chronic conditions, but it can be challenging to navigate. So I just want to be here to reflect back on that a little bit that those things do change. And if your parents are in beautiful health and older people in your world are doing great, for you to just remember that if it gets to that point and those things shift and happen, that it's kind of, in my experience, part of the circle of life and that's part of the way those things go. And it doesn't make any less beautiful all the wonderful experiences you've had. And I definitely get to cherish the times I spend with other people that I haven't met as close to that as they've dealt with health things, that I'm the person that just gets to walk in and have beautiful conversations and memories and laughter and.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:25:36

And those pieces, because I'm not the daughter, the close to them individual, that's the safe space for their working through those other pieces. So that's kind of the awareness that it is different from different angles and have been able to be there for my friends as they've navigated the challenges of being with somebody who's grappling with their mortality in some cases, and just the shifts as you age that things are a little bit different. Right? So as we do every week, we're going to have our self maintenance minute. And this is kind of fun because I'm going to broaden what I've done and put it into a broader context. So this self maintenance technique, I'll tell you specifically what I've done, but I'm going to give you the bigger picture of what it is. So this tool is basically finding something when things are really busy, when you have a lot going on and you're not getting to do something that you really enjoy and you really want to do, and to find ways to drip it into your day and make it tangible and connect to that and connect to the feelings related to that on a daily basis, even though you're not getting to experience it to its fullest. The way I've been doing that is I love to travel. I think we've talked about that.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:26:58

We've talked about how where I live now that travel doesn't quite get to be the same joy that it has been in the past, but I'm still doing some traveling, just not as much of it. And so we are going to be traveling for our mini moon because our honeymoon is being put off. So we can actually be gone longer and enjoy more depth. What I've been doing is that the last week, probably that to start my day, literally to start my day, I go find things that I need to pack for my mini moon because it's going to be beaches and ocean and sunshine again. Did I mention it snowed here recently? So because of that, I'm going to find those things that I'm going to be taking with me on my mini moon. And I have a shelf in my closet where I'm placing the items that are going to go with me on my mini moon. So I can reflect on sunshine and beaches and time to read and thinking about, like, what I'm going to be doing during that time away and giving my mind and body a mini break and a focus on preparing for that time. So it's almost like I'm getting little mini breaks leading up to that time away that I'm going to have.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:28:16

So I'm using my forward event that I'm looking forward to and preparing for it in little chunks by giving myself time to transport myself there, prepare myself for that, visualize that, to be ready for that. So the fact that I am doing this in advance is also going to alleviate stress right before I'm leaving to go get ready for the wedding. So that's my little self maintenance minute is giving myself this time to kind of visualize and prepare and have these moments where I'm just transporting myself to that in the future. That's a tool that I'm using. That if it resonates, it'd be lovely for you to consider as an option of just giving yourself a mental break and giving yourself preparation for something in the future that's going to bring you joy if you don't fully get to do it. And for our grit wit to kind of have your takeaway from this conversation we had today is to think about if it's not your parent, if it's not a grandparent or an elderly relative, somebody older in your life that is possibly going through these transitions of getting older and possibly having less control over there health and the decisions about things in their life and considering how you can be of support and give them more grace and give them more support, or if you have a friend or loved one that is experiencing that with an aging parent and a changing relationship as that person ages and they're trying to navigate how to connect better with their parent as they're dealing with medical shifts in their own world and might be feeling that, maybe connect with them and give them that support of understanding. Like, so what has this experience been like? How has it been interacting with your parent now that things are different, now that they're not the same? Because again, those parents, grandparents, older individuals, whether they have kids or not, right, like, their bodies are changing, their abilities are changing, and things are shifting for them. And they want their independence, they appreciate their independence, and yet they're recognizing that they can't do things all the same.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:30:32

I have folks not that much older than me that are joking about their vision shifting. And so night driving isn't fun anymore. And so even in little ways, people are starting to see things shift about their abilities, and it's hard to have those things shift and change, even in small ways. Right. So in bigger ways, when we feel like we're not as capable, it's hard to let go of that. And instead of people being curious and asking what's shifting and what that is like for them and what they're experiencing and assuring they can keep their independence as much as they can and having empathy and connection built out of that, you know, those difficult conversations, we've touched on that. Instead, it seems like it's more of a dividing point and more of a judgment point and more of a, well, now that you're this way, I've take these things on and pushing things away and driving wedges instead of it being a curiosity and a coming together point. So hopefully you can just reflect on the shifts someone else is going through and how to be curious and supportive.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:31:40

And as you're experiencing some of those things, to maybe not see it so much as being about you and being able to see what the experience is like for the person that's having those shifts and changes happening, that's having less control, that's having things happening that they can't change and that they're having to figure out how to grieve and how to adjust in their own world, and they need support and love around that and to check in on your friends and other people, you know, that might be going through that with their loved ones. I hope this is helpful if you have thoughts on this and other perspectives, I would love to hear them. So drop me a DM on Instagram or Facebook. I'd love to connect. Thanks for being here. Thank you for joining us today. I hope you enjoyed this episode. Be sure to jump on over to Instagram and follow us.

Shawna Rodrigues [: 00:32:32

The Grit show. And if you aren't already following authentic Connections podcast network at 37 by 27, you should definitely be doing that as well. Don't forget, you are the only one of you that this world has got, and that means something. I'll be here next Tuesday. I hope you are too.